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Hawgrider
08-16-2012, 08:11 AM
MOTORCYCLE WARNING! Feds Mandate Minimum 4 Gallon Ethanol-Blend Purchase August 7, 2012 By Press Release (http://www.aimag.com/wordpress/author/press-release/) 1 Comment (http://www.aimag.com/wordpress/2012/08/motorcycle-warning-feds-mandate-minimum-4-gallon-ethanol-blend-purchase/#comments)
The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency will require all consumers to buy at least four gallons of gasoline from certain gas pumps after the new E15 ethanol-gasoline blend is introduced into the market.
The EPA revealed the requirement to the American Motorcyclist Association in a letter dated Aug. 1, responding to AMA concerns that E15 — a gasoline formulation that contains up to 15 percent ethanol by volume — could be put in motorcycle and ATV gas tanks inadvertently when consumers use blender pumps. A blender pump dispenses different fuel blends through the same hose, and the vast majority of motorcycles and all-terrain vehicles in use today aren’t designed to operate on E15 fuel.
“With E15 gasoline, our members who make a concerted effort to fuel their motorcycles or ATVs with E10-or-less gasoline may be unknowingly refueling with residual fuel left in the hose,” Wayne Allard, AMA vice president for government relations, wrote in a June 20 letter to EPA Administrator Lisa Jackson.
“Unlike an automobile or SUV that has a large fuel tank, the residual fuel left in a fueling hose could be detrimental to the performance of motorcycle or ATV engines due to the small size of their fuel tanks and the higher concentration of ethanol that would, therefore, be present in the fuel,” Allard wrote.
“In addition, the use of E15 will lower fuel efficiency and possibly cause premature engine failure,” he wrote. “Use of E15 fuel voids many manufacturer warranties. In off-road engines, the effects can even be dangerous for users.”
Byron Bunker of the EPA National Vehicle and Fuel Emissions Laboratory responded to the AMA on behalf of Jackson.
“EPA requires that retail stations that own or operate blender pumps either dispense E15 from a dedicated hose and nozzle if able or, in the case of E15 and E10 being dispensed from the same hose, require that at least four gallons of fuel be purchased to prevent vehicles and engines with smaller fuel tanks from being exposed to gasoline-ethanol blended fuels containing greater than 10 volume percent ethanol,” Bunker wrote.
“Additionally, EPA is requiring that retail stations that offer E10 and E15 from the same hose and nozzle use additional labeling to inform consumers about the minimum purchase requirement,” Bunker wrote.
“Since motorcyclists and ATV users, as you suggest, have relatively small fuel tanks, they should pay careful attention to the labeling of blender pumps to ensure that an appropriate fuel is chosen, in this case E10 or E0,” he wrote.
Another problem with the new EPA policy, Allard said, is that not all motorcycle and ATV gas tanks hold four or more gallons.
“Not only do we find it unacceptable for the EPA to mandate that everyone — including our members — buy minimum amounts of gas, but the EPA answer simply won’t work because of the sizes of many motorcycle and ATV gas tanks and the fact that off-highway riders take containers of gas with them on their trips, and most times those containers are much smaller than four gallons,” Allard said.
“The EPA needs to come up with a better solution,” he said. “The EPA also needs to back an independent study to determine whether E15 is safe for motorcycle and ATV engines.”
The AMA has repeatedly expressed concerns to government officials and federal lawmakers about possible damage to motorcycle and ATV engines caused by the inadvertent use of E15 when the new fuel becomes widely available, and has asked that motorcycles and ATVs be part of any scientific study into the effects of E15.
Ethanol is essentially grain alcohol produced from crops such as corn that is mixed with gasoline to produce an ethanol-gasoline blend motor fuel. In October 2010, the EPA approved the use of E15 in model year 2007 and newer light-duty vehicles (cars, light-duty trucks and medium-duty passenger vehicles). Then, in January 2011, the EPA added model year 2001-06 light-duty vehicles to the approved list.
No motorcycles or ATVs are currently on the list.










http://www.aimag.com/wordpress/2012/08/motorcycle-warning-feds-mandate-minimum-4-gallon-ethanol-blend-purchase/

Mad Dog
08-16-2012, 08:29 AM
Good info....Thanks.

Mudpuppy
08-16-2012, 09:42 AM
the gas guru needs to chime in on this one

Gas Man
08-16-2012, 11:12 AM
I'm not for it. Too much issue with it.

If they are going to offer E10 and E15. Even in my car, I'd just always pump E10, F the E15.

The problem with ethynol is that it has a lower power amount, less BTUs. That's why in a flex fuel car, that gets 27mpg on E10, will get 15mpg on E85. The shit sucks. It is NOT the answer. In current E10 form it works well. It is water soluable and a great cleaner, so it keeps everything clean in your fuel system.

As I said, it's not the answer to get us off foreign oil. That answer is already in the works, Bakken Crude oil. Look it up!

RedneckMedic
08-16-2012, 11:56 AM
The problem with ethynol is that it has a lower power amount, less BTUs. That's why in a flex fuel car, that gets 27mpg on E10, will get 15mpg on E85.

My silverado is Flex fuel and I tried it out once because it was 30 cents cheaper per gallon than regular. I put enough in for a half tank and I swear I could watch the needle drop everytime I touched the gas. Never using it again.

Chain
08-16-2012, 01:27 PM
My silverado is Flex fuel and I tried it out once because it was 30 cents cheaper per gallon than regular. I put enough in for a half tank and I swear I could watch the needle drop everytime I touched the gas. Never using it again.

Yup! We did that too! A few years back, our wived followed us in the truck to Sturgis, and we put e85 in, thought we'd save money on gas... what a fukin joke!!!!!!!! We spent MORE!!!!!!

Fukin JA's, I'd like to kick the MFer right in the coin purse that came up with that idea! Not only for the BS that it will save our planet or pull us off foreign oil, but the FACT that millions world wide are starving and it takes 1 bushel of corn to produce 2.5 gallons of ethanol... I wonder how many loaves of bread that'd make...

JMHO

Gas Man
08-16-2012, 01:52 PM
I'm telling you guys... Bakken Oil

Enough in the Dakota's to last us 700+ years

Chain
08-16-2012, 01:59 PM
I've been following this. It's shale... I've heard this makes Saudi reserves look TINY! DRILL BABY DRILL!!!!!! Right thru the heart of a HOOT OWL!!!!!!!!! F it! I know N Dakota's unemployment rate is at around 3%, according to Fed. guidelines that's considered "full employment".... I also know Walmart greeters and Mc d's workers are starting at 15-16 per hour... because of the oil presence.

Gas Man
08-16-2012, 08:02 PM
It is shale oil. We offload it from rail cars at work. Store it in tanks and then ship it to the refinery in our pipeline. It's cool stuff. Looks like tainted mud water. It's a sweet crude, and still provides a good 110-125% crack during the refinery process. Further, the raw value of the product (minus logistics) is in the low $30's vs $110 for foreign oil.

There is 750+ years of oil in the shale in Dakotas and Canada. It's amazing. This is something we need to exploit and use.

The economy in the area is how you said Chain. This is a modern day gold rush. The area can't handle the boom of people, they have setup rv parks for people to live. It's crazy, people living in their cars, etc. You're right too on the per hour wages. $15-$18 an hour to flip burgers because why would you work there for $8 when you could go to the drill sites and make $30 an hour. Strippers are making $150k a year, these guys making $200k a year working crazy hours, got nothing else better to do. MODERN DAY GOLD RUSH CRAZY!!

junkyardjon
08-16-2012, 11:11 PM
seeing i don't buy fuel and always do a sample before pouring it into my bike's, i'm not to concerned with price.

Chain
08-17-2012, 08:12 AM
It is shale oil. We offload it from rail cars at work. Store it in tanks and then ship it to the refinery in our pipeline. It's cool stuff. Looks like tainted mud water. It's a sweet crude, and still provides a good 110-125% crack during the refinery process. Further, the raw value of the product (minus logistics) is in the low $30's vs $110 for foreign oil.

There is 750+ years of oil in the shale in Dakotas and Canada. It's amazing. This is something we need to exploit and use.

The economy in the area is how you said Chain. This is a modern day gold rush. The area can't handle the boom of people, they have setup rv parks for people to live. It's crazy, people living in their cars, etc. You're right too on the per hour wages. $15-$18 an hour to flip burgers because why would you work there for $8 when you could go to the drill sites and make $30 an hour. Strippers are making $150k a year, these guys making $200k a year working crazy hours, got nothing else better to do. MODERN DAY GOLD RUSH CRAZY!!

Yeah, I know a guy that works out there, said right now the housing is sooo far behind your lucky to find 1 room to rent for 1500 a month... :0 Your right, MODERN day gold rush. I don't think I could handle the winters... ugh.

Gas Man
08-17-2012, 02:40 PM
The winters are RUFF!

Caveman
08-17-2012, 04:48 PM
I just got back from Texas visiting my In-Laws. My BiL works as an independant contractor pump supervisor. He said that they have been pulling oil out of wells down there that were around 7500 feet deep. However, they are finding even more oil when they drill to 12000 or even 20K. Problem is they have to Frac the earth to get the oil to a pumpable well. The "Frac" or Fracturing process is controversial though as it puts a lot of chemicals into the earth that the treehuggers think is bad for the earth.

Mudpuppy
08-20-2012, 11:35 AM
I'm not for it. Too much issue with it.

If they are going to offer E10 and E15. Even in my car, I'd just always pump E10, F the E15.

The problem with ethynol is that it has a lower power amount, less BTUs. That's why in a flex fuel car, that gets 27mpg on E10, will get 15mpg on E85. The shit sucks. It is NOT the answer. In current E10 form it works well. It is water soluable and a great cleaner, so it keeps everything clean in your fuel system.

As I said, it's not the answer to get us off foreign oil. That answer is already in the works, Bakken Crude oil. Look it up!

Interesting and there is way more oil than that in the USA but they are sandbagging like a motherfucker to use up all the middle east oil so we have all the oil in the world. But there are way better alternatives than oil anyways. We don't need it.

Gas Man
08-20-2012, 04:12 PM
Let china pay the high costs of middle east oil. We can survive on our own. Seriously, we could survive on our own completely. We have the people, the technology and the drive.

Chain
08-21-2012, 09:09 AM
Let china pay the high costs of middle east oil. We can survive on our own. Seriously, we could survive on our own completely. We have the people, the technology and the drive.

NO lie!!!! I'd LOVE to live off the grid! Wind, Solar... it's JUST NOT THERE YET! That's why China (worlds largest polluter) Makes most of the worlds solar and wind products, but use's the least! They build a new coal burning plant like once a damn month.... And if any one is going to do it the cheapest way with the most out put, it's China!

Mudpuppy
08-21-2012, 09:49 AM
Technology is there it is just hampered by the financial aspect. We live like cavemen slaves to a piece of paper - stupid. Really the best bet for us here is natural gas - millions of years of supply of it. But the oil companies, again money issue, don't like the idea. We really don't need oil it is just profitable.

Chain
08-21-2012, 02:13 PM
yeah, "hampered" because it's NOT financially feasible... See there seems to be a direct correlation with the energy policies of the current "admin" and the price's that we are currently paying. Natural gas is being harvested heavily in the Dakotas, and currently were seeing pretty good prices. Remember, gas was under $2 just a mere 3 years ago.... Should be about .50 cents... ;)

Mudpuppy
08-21-2012, 03:55 PM
gas in venezuela is $0.40 a gallon right now