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telecast
01-27-2010, 08:23 AM
I am SO happy they're finally having their feet held to the fire. If you talk to people around the country you know there's a massive dislike for Detroit cars out there. Toyota has always been so 'perfect'...until now.

This really couldn't have come at a better time. And since it goes back 5 years and they tried to say it was a misplaced floor mat at first, well...I smell something rotten in Nippon land.

Watch, people who were in accidents or had family killed in accidents are going to revisit events. I smell lawsuits, and lots of them.

And some of the other parts of the country will get to experience having their main income provider shut down for an indefinite period. The ones who have no sympathy for Detroit and Michigan in general will get none from me.

Trainguy
01-27-2010, 09:01 AM
What he said^


:cool:

Mudpuppy
01-27-2010, 11:10 AM
Fuck yes - fuck you Toyota take that piece of crap company back to Japan and suffocate on it.. (then build our parts for our so called "American" cars so we can pretend we are buying american even though we sold out soul to the foreign devil to make an extra buck).. Regardless I hope they perish..

telecast
01-27-2010, 02:53 PM
Well I'll be....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100127/ap_on_bi_ge/toyota_recall

"The Obama administration said it pressed Toyota to protect consumers who own vehicles under recall and to stop building new cars with the problem.

Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood told WGN Radio in Chicago that "the reason Toyota decided to do the recall and to stop manufacturing was because we asked them to."

alhall88
01-27-2010, 04:39 PM
The articles are already popping up from toyota stating that the faulty parts in the accelerator pedal are made from an Americam Mfg..

Gas Man
01-27-2010, 05:22 PM
I'm with ya... I love the fact that for all these years they had their noses up in the air...

Just goes to show ya...

I know many of the american recalls, were voluntary like my HD gas tank recall.

Fuck them!

zamochit
01-27-2010, 09:50 PM
....

Bob
01-28-2010, 08:37 PM
I used to love Toyota until we rented a Matrix down in Florida. It was brand new and it was a pile of junk. My old 90 Civic had a better interior than this thing did. I miss the old Tubro Supra's myself. I wish they'd do something like that again.

But yes, it was an American company that made the part that is getting recalled.

telecast
01-28-2010, 09:07 PM
But yes, it was an American company that made the part that is getting recalled.

SPECIFIED, DESIGNED, and QA/QC'd by TOYOTA.

And this just in: Toyota has suspended the sales and production of a lot of models worldwide for the exact same reason, and the parts on those cars were NOT made by an American company.

Bob
01-28-2010, 09:28 PM
SPECIFIED, DESIGNED, and QA/QC'd by TOYOTA.

And this just in: Toyota has suspended the sales and production of a lot of models worldwide for the exact same reason, and the parts on those cars were NOT made by an American company.

I thought the pedals where made in Canada by CTS out of Indiana?

zamochit
01-28-2010, 09:54 PM
I'd still buy a Toyota over a GM product anyday.

Bob
01-28-2010, 09:57 PM
Fuck yes - fuck you Toyota take that piece of crap company back to Japan and suffocate on it.. (then build our parts for our so called "American" cars so we can pretend we are buying american even though we sold out soul to the foreign devil to make an extra buck).. Regardless I hope they perish..

LOL That's what I think is funny. All thee people buying Mexican made European cars with American car badges on them and snubbing their noses at the American made foreign car buyers. I think my 2001 Civic was the most American made car I've ever owned. LOL

Bob
01-28-2010, 10:00 PM
I'd still buy a Toyota over a GM product anyday.

You an me both man. I've turned into a Ford guy lately, after not being happy with our last Subaru. But I hate GM's. I can not stand their interiors. My parents are GM buyers and they have a Buick that seems like it's in the shop a lot and a new Impala that has a very plain/dull cheap interior and a sun roof that either whistles or rattles depending on the day. LOL I've had so many bad experiences with my own GM cars over the years it take a WHOLE lot to get me to ever consider one again. Although I said the same thing about Ford but they've come so far so fast I think.

Gas Man
01-28-2010, 10:13 PM
I wonder if Mud can shed some light on the pedal they are recalling. He's in that aspect of the car manfacturing

Mudpuppy
01-28-2010, 11:49 PM
negative ghostrider i build the equipment that builds the cars not involved in the design or parts.. i thought with the newer cars they are drive by wire but not sure if they are that advanced yet.. planes are.. so you would push the pedal but its not hooked to linkage its hooked to an electrical sensor that detects how far you pushed it and sends a signal to the cpu of the car telling it how much throttle to employ.. if that is the case then it seems like an easy fix just a flash or reprogram.. but it seems they are talking more of a mechanical issue so it could be drive by wire but the actual accelerator pedal is defective.. not sure.. i do know this that they are shutting down production in most plants, at least U.S., for 1 week - i have people in those plants doing work.. according to them its not a big deal really.. seems to me it is quite a big deal and lawsuits are brewing.. the other thing i know in terms of planes is the fly by wire is susceptible to lightning strikes which is what happened to the 747 that crashed over the atlantic - old planes could take a lightning strike and still fly through their hydraulics but the new planes its all electrical and a lightning strike makes the plane drop out of the sky like a rock completely disabling it..

the other thing i do know is that GM, just behind walmart, is an evil ruthless corporation and even more so now that the government has a hand in it along with the uaw.. i would never buy a GM vehicle under any terms.. over the years i have watched them fuck over countless people and companies..

Gas Man
01-29-2010, 12:27 AM
Yeah I know all about the fly by wire... even my HD is that way.

But it sure sounds like these cars are more conventional throttle cables.

telecast
01-29-2010, 08:07 AM
I thought the pedals where made in Canada by CTS out of Indiana?

Not the ones that are built overseas.

telecast
01-29-2010, 08:23 AM
LOL That's what I think is funny. All thee people buying Mexican made European cars with American car badges on them and snubbing their noses at the American made foreign car buyers. I think my 2001 Civic was the most American made car I've ever owned. LOL


And here's what I think is funny:

The ridiculous notion that a car built in the US is the same as a US made car. The fact is that when you buy a car with a foreign brand name about 80% of the profits go back overseas. If you buy a US branded vehicle, 90% of the money stays here.

The same holds true for US branded vehicles built in Canada or Mexico. True, they're using their workers, but the profits come back here.

So when you buy a US built Honda or Toyota the only US interest that is served are the workers themselves, not the company.

"Well, I don't give a shit about an evil company that size, I don't care if they get my profits or not."

If this last year didn't change your mind it damned sure should've.

The company I work for does work with Honda, GM, and Ford. We used to do Chrysler work too before they became privately held. We are a preferred supplier for GM and lost nothing during the bankruptcy. I get supplier discounts from all three. Short answer is I by GM. I've had Fords, the one I owned was nothing but problems. Had a Dodge once, never again, even though I'm sure they've changed their ways since then. The problems we've had with GM have been few and far between, and when we have had problems GM stepped up.

The biggest issue we ever had was a head gasket leak on my wife's Venture. It was 7,000 miles out of warranty. Dealer wanted $1500. I called GM customer service and told them I shouldn't have to pay for a head gasket on a vehicle with 43,000 miles on it. They agreed and said if I'd pay $150 deductible they'd cover the rest.

How is that a bad company?

BTW: I have never once stepped foot into a foreign car dealership. When it's time for a new car they aren't even on the radar.

Bob
01-29-2010, 07:16 PM
And here's what I think is funny:

The ridiculous notion that a car built in the US is the same as a US made car. The fact is that when you buy a car with a foreign brand name about 80% of the profits go back overseas. If you buy a US branded vehicle, 90% of the money stays here.

The same holds true for US branded vehicles built in Canada or Mexico. True, they're using their workers, but the profits come back here.

So when you buy a US built Honda or Toyota the only US interest that is served are the workers themselves, not the company.

"Well, I don't give a shit about an evil company that size, I don't care if they get my profits or not."

If this last year didn't change your mind it damned sure should've.

The company I work for does work with Honda, GM, and Ford. We used to do Chrysler work too before they became privately held. We are a preferred supplier for GM and lost nothing during the bankruptcy. I get supplier discounts from all three. Short answer is I by GM. I've had Fords, the one I owned was nothing but problems. Had a Dodge once, never again, even though I'm sure they've changed their ways since then. The problems we've had with GM have been few and far between, and when we have had problems GM stepped up.

The biggest issue we ever had was a head gasket leak on my wife's Venture. It was 7,000 miles out of warranty. Dealer wanted $1500. I called GM customer service and told them I shouldn't have to pay for a head gasket on a vehicle with 43,000 miles on it. They agreed and said if I'd pay $150 deductible they'd cover the rest.

How is that a bad company?

BTW: I have never once stepped foot into a foreign car dealership. When it's time for a new car they aren't even on the radar.

No offense man but that is by far the silliest thing I've ever read in my life. Those numbers are far from the truth.

When I buy an American made Honda those workers on the line get paid in US currency and spend the money in the US. Not to mention the truckers and transporters that haul the cars all over the US, or the dealers that sell them or the mechanics and shops that service them and then all of the small shops in the U.S. that made parts for them. I won't even get into shareholders, for those car companies on the market. But for some reason the US car market has most people fooled into thinking that it's different when you buy a Mexican built car that no US resident had a hand in building that all of this money magically appears in the states. Let's not even get into the big 3 CEO's and how they spend their money in foreign countries for items like furniture, construction material and whatever else they can import from Italy.

And why is it just cars that every cares about? Why is it that the same person that bitches about people buying "foreign" cars does it on his Japanese computer, sitting on his Chinese office chair while wearing their Malaysia made clothing?

And what shape do you think the big 3 would be in now if China or Europe said, "Don't by American cars only buy Chinese cars!" For one, GM would of went under a LONG time ago. The Chinese love Buicks and other GM cars. So if they took the same stand as some of us GM would of been long gone.

Bob
01-29-2010, 07:29 PM
p.s. I'm not trying to be a dick here. It just baffles my mind how people think their shit doesn't stink because they buy a Ford or Gm or Chrysler but 95% of everything else they buy says, "Made in China".

telecast
01-29-2010, 08:54 PM
You completely missed what I said, Bob. I did not say that 80% of the value of the car goes back overseas, I said 80% of the profit goes over seas. There's a big difference between net and gross. Car haulers, dealers, and everyone else you mentioned are part of the gross. But without the profit the company itself cannot stay alive. Something that should be self-evident in our current situation.

"And what shape do you think the big 3 would be in now if China or Europe said, "Don't by American cars only buy Chinese cars!" For one, GM would of went under a LONG time ago. The Chinese love Buicks and other GM cars. So if they took the same stand as some of us GM would of been long gone."

All true, but don't forget to ask in the same breath why US cars costs 4-5 times as much over there as we pay for the same vehicle, yet we pay the same, or in some cases less, than they do for their own vehicles. They don't have to say "buy Chinese cars only" when they make sure American cars are priced out of reach for all but a few.

"And why is it just cars that every cares about? Why is it that the same person that bitches about people buying "foreign" cars does it on his Japanese computer, sitting on his Chinese office chair while wearing their Malaysia made clothing?"

A silly argument indeed. Ths gets repeated over and over again. The answer is really quite simple:

There are no other choices.

I'd be more than happy to carry this argument to other markets. Where are they? What can I buy that I use in everyday life that was made in the US? I don't like it at all, but where are my options? Give me an example. I need a new computer. Do you have the name of a US built brand? How about a TV? I have a whole shop full of woodworking equipment. Which company should I buy from that's 100% American made? Not even Craftsman can boast that anymore.

The reason we bitch about foreign cars is because it's one of the very few things left we have to protect.

Gas Man
01-29-2010, 09:50 PM
I will say this...

You can break it down into engineering.

The products of these american companies are thought up and engineered here. Its the manufacturing that goes overseas.

Oh... and lets not forget why companies like toyota and honda ASSEMBLE cars here. Its cheaper for them. They don't pay the same taxes on the parts as they would on the entire assembled car.

Bob
01-30-2010, 08:10 AM
I will say this...

You can break it down into engineering.

The products of these american companies are thought up and engineered here. Its the manufacturing that goes overseas.

Oh... and lets not forget why companies like toyota and honda ASSEMBLE cars here. Its cheaper for them. They don't pay the same taxes on the parts as they would on the entire assembled car.

It's not just assembly though man. Something like 95% of my old Honda came from us. The freaking radio I pulled even said "Made in the USA" on it. I think the only foreign part on it was the trans that came from Japan.

Bob
01-30-2010, 08:23 AM
You completely missed what I said, Bob. I did not say that 80% of the value of the car goes back overseas, I said 80% of the profit goes over seas. There's a big difference between net and gross. Car haulers, dealers, and everyone else you mentioned are part of the gross. But without the profit the company itself cannot stay alive. Something that should be self-evident in our current situation.

"And what shape do you think the big 3 would be in now if China or Europe said, "Don't by American cars only buy Chinese cars!" For one, GM would of went under a LONG time ago. The Chinese love Buicks and other GM cars. So if they took the same stand as some of us GM would of been long gone."

All true, but don't forget to ask in the same breath why US cars costs 4-5 times as much over there as we pay for the same vehicle, yet we pay the same, or in some cases less, than they do for their own vehicles. They don't have to say "buy Chinese cars only" when they make sure American cars are priced out of reach for all but a few.

"And why is it just cars that every cares about? Why is it that the same person that bitches about people buying "foreign" cars does it on his Japanese computer, sitting on his Chinese office chair while wearing their Malaysia made clothing?"

A silly argument indeed. Ths gets repeated over and over again. The answer is really quite simple:

There are no other choices.

I'd be more than happy to carry this argument to other markets. Where are they? What can I buy that I use in everyday life that was made in the US? I don't like it at all, but where are my options? Give me an example. I need a new computer. Do you have the name of a US built brand? How about a TV? I have a whole shop full of woodworking equipment. Which company should I buy from that's 100% American made? Not even Craftsman can boast that anymore.

The reason we bitch about foreign cars is because it's one of the very few things left we have to protect.

Are you kidding? What can't you find made in the US?

DELL's are built in the US. Tenn. I think.
TV's, used to be Olivea but I think I rear they went under or filed for bankruptcy last year.
Crafstmans went to junk years ago. S-K is US made so is Snap-On

I mean there is some things you won't find but my New Balance shoes are made in the US along with my Carhartt jacket and I wasn't even trying to find US made products when I bought them.

It just baffles me that people won't buy a foreign car but won't even try and find US products for everything else.

If you truly want to be a buy american only household it probably isn't going to be doable. However, if you are going to bark at not buying foreign cars because the profits go overseas you should at least make an effort not to buy foreign made products period instead of just saying, "There are no choices".

telecast
01-30-2010, 09:17 AM
Are you kidding? What can't you find made in the US?

DELL's are built in the US. Tenn. I think.

They're assembled in the US. All (or most) of the parts come from overseas. BTW, I'm typing this on a Dell.


TV's, used to be Olivea but I think I rear they went under or filed for bankruptcy last year.

AFAIK, Curtis Mathis was the last stronghold of US built TV's with predominantly US made parts. Almost every small part on the inside of a brand name TV regardless of manufacturer is made by Hitachi or Sony, except off-brand the Chinese TV's which use chaper parts.


Crafstmans went to junk years ago. S-K is US made so is Snap-On

Yup. Neither of them make woodworking tools, strictly mechanic's tools.


I mean there is some things you won't find but my New Balance shoes are made in the US along with my Carhartt jacket and I wasn't even trying to find US made products when I bought them.

Well, I don't wear tennis shoes, but I do have a full set of Carharts.


It just baffles me that people won't buy a foreign car but won't even try and find US products for everything else.

If you truly want to be a buy american only household it probably isn't going to be doable. However, if you are going to bark at not buying foreign cars because the profits go overseas you should at least make an effort not to buy foreign made products period instead of just saying, "There are no choices".

I do try, but the unfortunate truth is it's very, very difficult to find normal stuff for everyday use. All of my guitars and amps are US made, as are my cars, my bikes, and whatever else I can find. I should've probably said 'We have very few choices as opposed to 'no choice', but it doesn't change the fact that something assembled in the US, whether it's a car or a computer is not the same as made in the US when it comes to our economy.

I'm currently working on a couple of projects that have partial ARRA funding. That's the money Obama gave out to provide jobs, which is an abysmal failure, but some of the billions did make it to actual projects. Part of the deal is that everything has to be made in the US.

This country buys a LOT of pipe from China. Big pipe, water mains, etc. For these projects the Contractor must not only use US made pipe, but state in writing that's made in the US. Good deal, right? It keeps workers busy and profits at the US manufacturers. But as you stated before there are others invloved, not just the manufacturer. So, what about the American workers who handle it, like product reps that sell it? The dealers that stock it? The truckers who haul it from the docks? The longshoremen who unload it? Who's doing something to save their jobs? And even at that, the requirement has cost projects more money because it's cheaper to buy pipe from China than it is to buy US made pipe. Still, everyone recognizes the importance of keeping the profits over here for these companies to stay viable.

Bob
01-30-2010, 09:27 AM
They're assembled in the US. All (or most) of the parts come from overseas. BTW, I'm typing this on a Dell.
Same as your American cars though. They might be assembled here but the parts come from Mexico or China for the most part. Or Europe often with GM.





Yup. Neither of them make woodworking tools, strictly mechanic's tools.

Take your pic

Barr Specialty Tools (McCall, ID)
Bridge City Tool Works (Portland, OR)
INCRA Precision Tools (Dallas, TX)
Lie-Nielsen Toolworks (Warren, ME)
Pacific Rack & Machine (Medford, OR)
U.J. Ramelson Co. (Newark, NJ)
Woodpeckers Inc. (North Royalton, OH)

;)

telecast
01-30-2010, 09:54 AM
Same as your American cars though. They might be assembled here but the parts come from Mexico or China for the most part. Or Europe often with GM.

Very true, but it still doesn't change where the profits go, which was the main point to begin with.



Take your pic

Barr Specialty Tools (McCall, ID)
Bridge City Tool Works (Portland, OR)
INCRA Precision Tools (Dallas, TX)
Lie-Nielsen Toolworks (Warren, ME)
Pacific Rack & Machine (Medford, OR)
U.J. Ramelson Co. (Newark, NJ)
Woodpeckers Inc. (North Royalton, OH)

;)

All nice stuff, but not an electric saw, sander, drill, router, planer, etc etc in the bunch. All are specialty tools.

All of the mainstream tools brands that I'm aware of are made overseas. Milwaukee, DeWalt, Delta-Porter Cable, Jett, Grizzly.

Makita and Ryobi speak for themselves.

Skil, Crafstman, B&D and other homeowner grade brands aren't.

Bob
01-30-2010, 10:13 AM
Very true, but it still doesn't change where the profits go, which was the main point to begin with.




All nice stuff, but not an electric saw, sander, drill, router, planer, etc etc in the bunch. All are specialty tools.

All of the mainstream tools brands that I'm aware of are made overseas. Milwaukee, DeWalt, Delta-Porter Cable, Jett, Grizzly.

Makita and Ryobi speak for themselves.

Skil, Crafstman, B&D and other homeowner grade brands aren't.

Profits go to the shareholders though man. Some dude in Japan could own a billion shares of Ford if he wanted to. LOL Same with the Japanese makers. If we had the money we could be majority share holders.


Yeah, my Makita polisher was a Chinese or Mexican model and it was horrible. Lasted me about 3 years of very little use. I now use my Cyclo Polisher more than anything and it's a very sturdy made in the US tool. Aluminum case and all. When Danase was in full swing all of our products came from the US with the exception of our microfiber towels which came from Korea. That I never could find a good US maker of microfiber.

Bob
01-30-2010, 11:02 AM
I found this too man, not sure if it has anything you need though.

http://www.wmma.org/

telecast
01-30-2010, 11:10 AM
Cool site, I'll check it out in full as soon as I can.

So, I'm back and forth to the basement working on a bass cabinet for a customer. I have 97.1 on and they were discussing the exact same thing. Half the people were arguing my side, and the other half were arguing yours. Talk about timing!

At any rate, thanks for an interesting discussion.

Ok, back to the basement, I gotta' get this cab out. The plywood comes from Argentina. The tweeters come from Brazil. The bass drivers are Eminence and come from the good old USA. The electronic components for the crossover I have to build are most likely from China. The screws, glue, and other stuff is anyone's guess.

But, I keep the profits! :p

Mudpuppy
01-30-2010, 11:23 AM
i found out more - the toyotas are drive by wire and the issue is the electrical sensor that sends the message how much throttle to send to the computer.. the issue is moisture, etc. get in there and weaken the spring and make it stick.. so it doesn't disengage when you let off or try to stop.. toyota failed to put in a fail safe that most other manufacturers do which is when the brake is depressed it disregards the signal from the accelerator..

Bob
01-30-2010, 11:23 AM
Cool site, I'll check it out in full as soon as I can.

So, I'm back and forth to the basement working on a bass cabinet for a customer. I have 97.1 on and they were discussing the exact same thing. Half the people were arguing my side, and the other half were arguing yours. Talk about timing!

At any rate, thanks for an interesting discussion.

Ok, back to the basement, I gotta' get this cab out. The plywood comes from Argentina. The tweeters come from Brazil. The bass drivers are Eminence and come from the good old USA. The electronic components for the crossover I have to build are most likely from China. The screws, glue, and other stuff is anyone's guess.

But, I keep the profits! :p

I thought you where trying to say a base cabinet like in a kitchen or bathroom and then you started talking about electronics and lost me. I had to reread it. LMAO

telecast
01-30-2010, 11:37 AM
I re-did my own kitchen and have been asked countless times to build cabinets for others. The problem is 'friends' expect you to spend all summer constructing their kitchen for next to nothing. I don't mind helping out at all, but I draw the line at building someone's cabinets for $10 and hour, my time is more valuable than that. Custom pro sound and home theater cabs are a lot more profitable. I don't do a lot anymore, I typically take on only 3 or 4 builds a year.

Bob
01-30-2010, 11:53 AM
I re-did my own kitchen and have been asked countless times to build cabinets for others. The problem is 'friends' expect you to spend all summer constructing their kitchen for next to nothing. I don't mind helping out at all, but I draw the line at building someone's cabinets for $10 and hour, my time is more valuable than that. Custom pro sound and home theater cabs are a lot more profitable. I don't do a lot anymore, I typically take on only 3 or 4 builds a year.

Good deal man. I tried to build a box for a sub once and it sounded like crap. Ended up going with this local guy, not even sure if he's around anymore, and it sounded so much better. LOL

vortech302
01-30-2010, 04:40 PM
I'm way after the fact but it's a tough decision: Buy a car made in America and keep Americans working or buy from an American company and keep the money here.

Gas Man
01-30-2010, 06:33 PM
Here's a couple truths regardless

Your dell tech help is in India!! :(


i found out more - the toyotas are drive by wire and the issue is the electrical sensor that sends the message how much throttle to send to the computer.. the issue is moisture, etc. get in there and weaken the spring and make it stick.. so it doesn't disengage when you let off or try to stop.. toyota failed to put in a fail safe that most other manufacturers do which is when the brake is depressed it disregards the signal from the accelerator..

Crap! How can I do a burn out with that safety junk!

FYI... neither my SS or HD with fly by wire have this fail safe... they both will allow me to do both throttle and brake.


I re-did my own kitchen and have been asked countless times to build cabinets for others. The problem is 'friends' expect you to spend all summer constructing their kitchen for next to nothing. I don't mind helping out at all, but I draw the line at building someone's cabinets for $10 and hour, my time is more valuable than that. Custom pro sound and home theater cabs are a lot more profitable. I don't do a lot anymore, I typically take on only 3 or 4 builds a year.

You make car audio sub boxes?
Do you cover them as well?

I will be looking into doing a system again in the next car.

Bob
01-30-2010, 07:48 PM
Here's a couple truths regardless

Your dell tech help is in India!! :(




Yeah but according to you guys that's ok because the profits stay here. LOL

Bob
01-30-2010, 07:49 PM
Just be careful man:
http://www.bikernewsonline.com/2008/04/fly-by-wire-harley-problems.htm

RoadZombie
01-30-2010, 08:29 PM
I'm plenty happy with the old cable system on my bike. My F150 is fly by wire though. Don't care for it at all. It feels...removed. I like having that physical connection between me and the throttle plates. Now these stories...yesh.

Gas Man
01-30-2010, 10:09 PM
Removed? I have had that on my 2004 F150 and I think people put too much in thought into it. I think its all in your head. I have never felt any difference.

Some complaign of lag. But honestly that is more due to the MAP and fuel system not the throttle "linkage".

telecast
01-30-2010, 10:20 PM
You make car audio sub boxes?
Do you cover them as well?


Yes, and yes.

Gas Man
01-30-2010, 11:46 PM
Remind me when I get my new car in Sept. I may need a new sub box.

RoadZombie
01-31-2010, 12:34 AM
Removed? I have had that on my 2004 F150 and I think people put too much in thought into it. I think its all in your head. I have never felt any difference.

Some complaign of lag. But honestly that is more due to the MAP and fuel system not the throttle "linkage".

The old cable system had a mechanical feel to them. A potentiometer just doesn't feel the same. I don't really notice any lag per se...hard to explain. And I know it's not in my head...I had the truck 6 months before I even knew it was "fly by wire". Just always seemed...off. Wasn't until I ran out of wiper fluid and popped the hood and realised, "Hey, where's the throttle cable?". The downfalls of free preventative maintainence. ;-)

Gas Man
01-31-2010, 02:14 AM
Well maybe I just don't analyse it that much. I think they feel fine. I really thought out of all of them... the bike would be the worse and its not. If anything they are always smooth

Outlaw
02-01-2010, 12:49 PM
:p

http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m276/JD03Cobra/Toyota.jpg

Mudpuppy
02-02-2010, 11:54 AM
^^ awesome

I get some lag with my R6 because it is carbs not EFI.. i put on a 520 chain and sprockets and it seemed to help with that issue.. its like a delay from idle to full throttle it takes a second then it takes off..

telecast
02-03-2010, 04:37 PM
Whoa...

Just...whoa...

The back-and-forth played out as word surfaced that Toyota Motor Corp. also has been the subject of more than 100 complaints in the U.S. and Japan about brake problems with the popular Prius gas-electric hybrid, which is not part of the recall. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has received about 100 complaints, two of them involving crashes that resulted in injuries. In addition, Japan's transport ministry said it had received 14 complaints.

Mudpuppy
02-03-2010, 05:15 PM
yep the japanese government, who previously protected their prized company, is now on the attack too.. sucks to be you toyota.. floor mats my ass..

telecast
02-04-2010, 08:24 AM
I'd say they can't 'catch a break'. :D

Mudpuppy
02-04-2010, 11:14 AM
they are piling on now.. this is going to ruin toyota - too bad so sad.. i really hope it doesn't negatively affect public perception on foreign vehicles like they have been doing for years with domestics for no apparent reason other than to totally fuck over this country and give away everything we have worked and fought so hard for - NOT! I hope it destroys all foreign competition and we repeal NAFTA and any other bullshit free trade agreements - FUCK EM! And the latest is the almighty Prius - the gayest fucking car ever made for the dick sucking tree huggers - now has brake issues - muhahahahahaha.. Suck on that Steve Jobs you fucking prius driving asshole..

telecast
02-04-2010, 01:14 PM
C'mon Mud, don't hold back, tell us how you really feel....

Mudpuppy
02-04-2010, 01:35 PM
Well its like a breath of fresh air.. For YEARS the media has been bashing on the big 3 - why? no idea.. and for bullshit.. Like the Ford Explorer deal - that was bullshit - of course you can't load past the max rating with underinflated tires on any truck or SUV that happen to be susceptible to rollover just by nature of design.. duh.. But it about put Ford out of business.. And people all over this country and even here have this fuck domestics attitude that pisses me off.. I am tired of watching Detroit and this country get ruined by the fucked up attitude.. Between this and companies like Walmart we don't have a prayer.. Hopefully this sparks a little upswing at least in this local area.. We could use some good news for once.. And I work for a foreign company so my market is totally global so I understand the "new" global free trade sell your soul for a penny marketplace and that is what puts bread on the table for me but it still doesn't make it right..

Outlaw
02-06-2010, 07:26 PM
here's a good one....:)

http://i974.photobucket.com/albums/ae229/Malicious340/toyoter.jpg

Bob
02-06-2010, 07:31 PM
I think our government is hitting Toyota right now because they are pissed off over the Japanese cash for clunkers program. Which does suck. I think the Ford Escape is like the only US vehicle to make the list or something like that.

Mad Dog
02-06-2010, 10:22 PM
Bought an 03 Chevy Impala new. Drive the piss out of it (120k so far). Never wash it but do maintain it mechanically. Haven't put $500 into repairs since new. You can have your imports I'll keep my american piece of shit.:D

Gas Man
02-06-2010, 10:58 PM
Bought an 03 Chevy Impala new. Drive the piss out of it (120k so far). Never wash it but do maintain it mechanically. Haven't put $500 into repairs since new. You can have your imports I'll keep my american piece of shit.:D
Word to your mother!!

I hear there is abig recall on the Gayous.

Outlaw
02-07-2010, 10:30 AM
http://asset.soup.io/asset/0675/0940_b8bb_480.jpeg

Gas Man
02-07-2010, 10:52 AM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100207/ap_on_bi_ge/toyota_recall

RoadZombie
02-07-2010, 11:03 AM
Pfff! Like the thing needs brakes anyways. Ever get stuck behind a homo-mobile on an expressway on-ramp? Rubberbands and hampsters don't make for good accelleration, I'll tell ya that.

Mudpuppy
02-08-2010, 09:39 AM
here's a good one....:)

http://i974.photobucket.com/albums/ae229/Malicious340/toyoter.jpg

Fantastic!

telecast
02-09-2010, 04:32 PM
New Toyota news. Now their trying to steer the investigation. Nice.

If you read this article, note the one line about an investigation into reports of steering problems with Corollas.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100209/ap_on_bi_ge/toyota_recall

Mudpuppy
02-09-2010, 05:05 PM
ohhhhhh what a feeling.....toyoda!

telecast
02-21-2010, 10:34 PM
Just keeps getting better.

Anyone besides me old enough to remember their old ad slogan?

"You asked for it, you got it, Toyota."

WASHINGTON – Toyota officials claimed they saved the company $100 million by successfully negotiating with the government on a limited recall of floor mats in some Toyota and Lexus vehicles, according to new documents shared with congressional investigators.
Toyota, in an internal presentation in July 2009 at its Washington office, said it saved $100 million or more by negotiating an "equipment recall" of floor mats involving 55,000 Toyota Camry and Lexus ES350 vehicles in September 2007.
The savings are listed under the title, "Wins for Toyota — Safety Group." The document cites millions of dollars in other savings by delaying safety regulations, avoiding defect investigations and slowing down other industry requirements.

Mad Dog
02-21-2010, 10:49 PM
"You asked for it, you got it, Toyota."

Hell Yeah. Give it to em!:)

RedneckMedic
02-21-2010, 11:37 PM
any one else see the commercial for the "swagger wagon" yet for their mini-van quite possibly the stupidest one ive ever seen

Mudpuppy
02-22-2010, 10:29 AM
nope but i have seen the commercial where they apologize and promise to provide quality vehicles like they have for the past 50 years..

telecast
02-22-2010, 11:50 AM
nope but i have seen the commercial where they apologize and promise to provide quality vehicles like they have for the past 50 years..


Well, except for that one period, you know...where we made some crap and kept it quiet? We were hoping no one would get hurt, but we figured a few deaths was worth the money. Hell, we saved $100mil on the deal...but honest, we're going to provide good stuff from now on, I swear....

Mudpuppy
02-22-2010, 01:15 PM
scout's honor right?

Gas Man
02-23-2010, 11:23 PM
Even the precious Lexus crap!!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100224/ap_on_bi_ge/toyota_recall

Is it wrong of me to be gitty happy about this??

But as a side note... HOW FUCKIN STUPID ARE PEOPLE???



Rhonda Smith, of Sevierville, Tenn., said her Lexus raced out of control to speeds up to 100 miles an hour, and that nothing she did to try to stop it worked including braking and shifting into neutral. "I prayed to God to help me," she said, fighting back tears.

"After six miles, God intervened" and slowed the car, Smith said. She said she was finally able to pull off the road onto a median and turn off the engine. She said it took a long time for Toyota to respond to her complaints and even then it was dismissive.


Six miles? And it never dawned on your dumb bitch ass to turn the flippin key off??? WTF!!! IDIOTS!! not just for buying a F'in toyota but for just being born an idiot!! Shame on her for being such a fuckin TOOL!

Then this asshat shit...


Congressional panels are asking whether computerized modern automotive electronics designed to make cars more efficient can sometimes make them less safe.

Ya know a throttle cable could hang up!!! The problem isn't technology, its poorly enginnered and crap sub contracted workmenship. Hell even when my Harley detects something wrong with its ecu or throttle by wire it goes into "limp" mode. Your throttle cabled vechicle wouldn't be able to do that! Toyota made crap... now everybody knows!

telecast
02-24-2010, 08:07 AM
Even the precious Lexus crap!!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100224/ap_on_bi_ge/toyota_recall

Is it wrong of me to be gitty happy about this??

But as a side note... HOW FUCKIN STUPID ARE PEOPLE???



Six miles? And it never dawned on your dumb bitch ass to turn the flippin key off??? WTF!!! IDIOTS!! not just for buying a F'in toyota but for just being born an idiot!! Shame on her for being such a fuckin TOOL!



In her defense, if she shut off the engine she'd have no steering. I doubt she could muscle the steering wheel around, not like the old days when you could get by in a pinch without power steering. Seems like at 100mph that'd be a bad choice.

I saw her testimony on the news last night. She even put the damned thing in REVERSE and it kept going. Must be some kind of override to stop you from shifting into reverse when moving forward.

RoadZombie
02-24-2010, 05:01 PM
Six miles? And it never dawned on your dumb bitch ass to turn the flippin key off??? WTF!!! IDIOTS!! not just for buying a F'in toyota but for just being born an idiot!! Shame on her for being such a fuckin TOOL!



No...I watched her testimony on NBC Nightly News last night. She did say she turned the key off and it didn't do anything. Thats what I was thinking too when they ran the "abbreviated" clip, but later on in the program they ran her WHOLE testimony. Sounds like something in the ECM is shorting out.

As for putting it in reverse...neutral...or any gear but drive, this too is now controlled by the ECM and a servo motor where there once was a physical connection. From what it sounds like, the ECM is "freaking out" and doing whatever it wants to do all while ignoring it's inputs. Just what I'd want in a car! LoL

Mad Dog
02-24-2010, 05:24 PM
Watched part of the "congressional grilling" of Toyota today. At about 4:30 today I must say they were well done!

Gas Man
02-24-2010, 11:57 PM
Well ok then... she did more... check... reered bk on my attack.

This just in...

Toyota offers only manual shift cars now... so you can put it in reverse when your ECM fails... and IT WILL!

Mudpuppy
02-25-2010, 10:19 AM
Holy shit - the Feds are raiding suppliers now..

http://www.freep.com/article/20100225/BUSINESS0104/2250570/1318/

telecast
02-25-2010, 12:36 PM
Yeah, saw that on the news. There's a whole bunch of people saying this is a witch hunt against Toyota because the US is trying to prop up US automakers. But this supplier investigation originated in Europe, and the feds are doing this at someone else's request.

And, if it is a witch hunt...well, I'm ok with that too!

Mudpuppy
02-25-2010, 05:06 PM
hunt them witches then BURN them!

http://www.photoforum.ru/f/photo.th/000/375/375136_80.th.jpg

i spend everyday trying to compete with these fucking networks and its impossible.. when you have to remove the guy's lips off the motherfucker's cock just to get a chance to quote something its a waste of time kwim?

RoadZombie
02-25-2010, 07:08 PM
yp_l5ntikaU

Gas Man
02-25-2010, 11:12 PM
Fuck em

They have had this comin.

Mudpuppy
02-26-2010, 12:49 AM
i love monty python..

Mad Dog
02-26-2010, 08:21 AM
They asked for it. They got it! Toiletta!

telecast
10-21-2010, 01:07 PM
Hey Bob, please make this thread a sticky so I don't have to look for it when there's a new recall!!!! :p

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101021/ap_on_bi_ge/as_japan_toyota_recall

I can't ever remember a single manufacturer having so many different recalls in such a short time.

sprink
10-21-2010, 04:36 PM
Best thread I've read in a long time. Thanks for bringing it back so I saw it.

Fuck Toyota and all the people who worship them.

dogbreath
10-21-2010, 04:36 PM
Is it okay if I only like old Toyotas?

Mudpuppy
10-21-2010, 04:46 PM
so i should get the toyota tattoo removed? lol..

dogbreath
10-21-2010, 04:47 PM
so i should get the toyota tattoo removed? lol..

I don't know what I'm going to do about this mural of a Prius on my chest.

Mudpuppy
10-21-2010, 05:28 PM
oh i would definitely save that.. if you drive a Prius it says you are uber macho.. you are a man's man..

aeryck
10-21-2010, 05:40 PM
Heh, there was a nasty accident not too long ago on us23 at lee rd, a prius crossed the median and smashed a suv head on.. 4 fatalities. Looks like someone ignored the recall notice.

sprink
10-21-2010, 05:57 PM
Is it okay if I only like old Toyotas?

My best friend had a late 70's Celica that was amazing. Hell it drove 10 miles home with a hole in the block. Someone stopped the next day and asked about it because it was in the street in front of the house. Steve told him the motor was blown up, but the guy wanted it for parts. Sold, handed title. Came back in a few, started it and drove it away.....

dogbreath
10-21-2010, 06:06 PM
My first truck was a Toyota Hilux with a blown 305, later on I put together a 75 Celica GT with a 22RE (from the Hilux :P). The 22RE had 612,000 miles on it when I sold it and the guy who bought it still drives the car daily. That's with only one internal part replaced, an intake valve which I demolished by starting the car on year-old gasoline. Since then I've owned a 4th gen Celica ST and right now I've got an AE86 Trueno taken apart in my driveway.

Before anyone goes and calls me some America-hating Toyota fanboy, keep in mind I have a 2006 Impala and a 2006 Silverado, both of which I bought new while I worked for GM.

vortech302
10-22-2010, 10:12 AM
oh i would definitely save that.. if you drive a Prius it says you are uber macho.. you are a man's man..

Haha, my old neighbor drove a Prius and I used to tell him "Thanks for making the world a better place by driving that Prius, it equals out the 14 mpg I get in this Ram".
And not that I'm a Toyota fan, but GM did that voluntary recall on the Malibu a couple weeks ago, and watching the news it made me laugh how they kept saying "GM did this recall voluntarily to fix the problems people were having, they were not forced to like Toyota". BFD, if they were in a position to they would have let the problem go as long as they could.

Mudpuppy
10-22-2010, 11:19 AM
Yes we should all recall the S10 gas tanks blowing up, Pinto madness, all that good shit.. they are all in it for profit and nothing else.. they may claim they care about you but honestly they wouldn't even consider saving you if you were choking in a parking lot and they walked by..

telecast
10-22-2010, 11:33 AM
There've been several recalls lately where the news 'applauded' the automaker's efforts to get the word out on their own. The local news said the same thing about this latest Toyota recall. Short answer is they're all on edge because of the nastiness that followed the Toyota accelerator pedal problem, especially since Toyota knew about it for about 5 or 6 months from the Japanese market before it became a topic over here. That's way too fresh in everyone's minds.

Add to it the public perception of US automakers everywhere that's not SE Michigan and you can bet the big three aren't going to take any chances. I'll bet the Malibu recall got a whole different spin in the People's Republic of Kaleyforney.

Give it a few years to settle down and they'll all be back to business as usual.

junkyardjon
10-22-2010, 08:40 PM
every manufacture has ton's of recalls, ain't nothing new and it ain't gonna change. never mind about the silent recalls that consumers don't know about LOL. i can care let about who there from cause there all shit wagons. i work on new cars everyday, all makes and models so i know there all junk.

Mudpuppy
10-25-2010, 01:18 PM
all i know is toyota sponsors a shitload of shit.. i see their name everywhere..

junkyardjon
10-25-2010, 08:23 PM
Ford needs to recall all column shifter cars and put lock tight on the bolts for the shifter. no joke, the bolts back out and break off. i'm tired of fixing this problem.

as soon as they say there car/truck shifter ain't working or it won't go into park/into gear or there car/truck rolled into and smacked something, it's the first thing i look at. every time it's been the problem.

dogbreath
10-25-2010, 08:39 PM
Just got my Toyota up and running ;)

Bob
10-25-2010, 08:42 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVkedyQZfwQ

dogbreath
10-25-2010, 08:59 PM
The only thing that will kill a Hilux is rust. Also, old Toyotas rust a lot. I guess they have to, or there'd be so many Hiluxes left that everyone would have to shovel them out of the way to get their dispose-a-cars.

Bob
10-25-2010, 09:27 PM
The only thing that will kill a Hilux is rust. Also, old Toyotas rust a lot. I guess they have to, or there'd be so many Hiluxes left that everyone would have to shovel them out of the way to get their dispose-a-cars.

I remember wanting an old Toyota truck, probably because of Marty McFly, but all of the ones I found back then were pure rust. Ran great but the beds and bodies where hanging on by threads.

dogbreath
10-25-2010, 09:52 PM
I remember wanting an old Toyota truck, probably because of Marty McFly, but all of the ones I found back then were pure rust. Ran great but the beds and bodies where hanging on by threads.

It's pretty typical. Everyone was scrambling to find the cheapest steel they could and Toyota found the cheapest :P

Mudpuppy
10-26-2010, 12:01 PM
i am going to buy a new toyota today - NOT!

dogbreath
10-26-2010, 12:19 PM
From the way I see it, Toyota is just making all the same mistakes GM made back in the day. They ran out of room to grow and started cutting costs and it's going to bite them in 20 years when Chinese Republic Motors is the #1 automaker.

telecast
10-26-2010, 01:20 PM
From the way I see it, Toyota is just making all the same mistakes GM made back in the day.

That makes it worse. It seems they'd have people over there smart enough to learn from someone else's mistakes.

"Hey, don't touch the stove, it's hot."

"OUCH!"

"Told you so..."

dogbreath
10-26-2010, 01:55 PM
That makes it worse. It seems they'd have people over there smart enough to learn from someone else's mistakes.


Or it's just a reflection of the human condition.